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In this very special 'Gurometer Tune-Up Edition' of Decoding the Gurus, our resident Gurometricians, Chris and Matt, embark on the riveting task of recalibrating the highly sensitive Gurometer tool. With the finesse of master craftsmen, they make subtle adjustments to align the missing moral grandstanding scores for an eclectic mix of would-be gurus. Expect competitive scoring, fiery debates, and, of course, a sprinkle of the purest humility as Matt and Chris sacrifice their mental health on the altar of secular guru evaluation.

Sources - Tosi, J., & Warmke, B. (2016). Moral grandstanding. Philosophy & Public Affairs, 44(3), 197-217.- Tosi, J., & Warmke, B. (2020). Grandstanding: The use and abuse of moral talk. Oxford University Press.- Gurometer scores to date

Comments

iffydonatello

Matt: "Not to disagree with you, because I know where that leads..." Brutal.

Salex

The Diatribes of Kavanagh - great start 😂

CHUSSTERR

Good. I've been saying the gurometer needs to be a thermometer that goes in the butt.

Jake

I don't see this on my Galaxy Brain Feed (Patreon rss link), is it stuck somewhere?

Salex

I listened back to the Eliezer Yudkowsky episode recently because of the whole zizian/ lesswrong thing. And I was weirded out for a bit because I was actually feeling sorry for Lex, like trying to work through those legit bananas hypotheticals. And then he started talking about Love and Empathy, and I was like, “There he is! There’s the Lex I’ve come to know and despise!”

Cole Rees

It sounds like moral grandstanding is taking a moral posture to raise your own profile, as opposed to a genuine moral expression of your values. So how would you rate characters like Greta thurenberg, Martin Luther King, Malcolm x?

Tree

Its always physicists.

Adam Sher

Your updated scores of Jordan and Brand are reducing your own profit seeking ability. That was clearly an exercise for DtG Second Edition - Gurus Rescored!

Adam Sher

Hahaha, Chris's parting comment - score them if you feel differently than us. You'll find out we're right. Grabbed a +1 there

Brice F

3 criteria of MG 1) moral issue’s severity is disconnected from the intensity of the argument 2) grandstander proclaims moral purity and their adversaries are debased/evil 2b) sometimes a topic is so immoral that it’s not even considered worthy of discussion 3) moral principles proclaimed are often not followed

Roland Weber

This doesn't show up in the Galaxy Brain RSS feed yet. 🤔

Kit Zullasson

Is it possible to judge others' moral grandstanding without engaging in moral grandstanding yourself? I don’t know if you guys attempted that, but if so, I don’t see much success. Though the meta-grandstanding (maybe "megastanding") might be less questionable 😉

Alex H

Lol the disagreement between Chris and Matt about stupidity/laziness of anti-vaxxers. I enjoyed that, and it is an important clarification.

Barn

Linda Sears

I fall squarely in the anti-AI in art moral grandstanding category. I even have an Anti-AI in Art Manifesto in my Canvas module to make it clear to my students why I don’t want them to use AI in their creative projects.

Frances goulart

Gee, are mommy and daddy fighting? You two also seem to be more or less on the same page! It must be this topic!!!

Bas

Chris' chatgpt moral grandstanding rant at the beginning sounds a lot like Lex. Was Lex part of the prompt? If not, it's very suspicious chatgpt’s moral grandstanding sounds so much like him

Linda Sears

I’m enjoying hearing you two refine the concept of moral grandstanding by looking at examples like the Dalai Lama and Mr. Rogers. It’s like getting a peak into the inner workings of the gurometer.

Ando

Spending an hour pointing out peoples lack of humility has got to be worthy of a 5. I'm giving DTG a 5 for moral grandstanding

Dirtybird

Is it grandstanding to be against ai because of climate change

Nancy Hale

The most heated I’ve heard Matt & Chris get. Watch out, before long they’ll be at Batya vs Moynihan level.

Kerena

Thank you for defending Mr. Rogers!

Kyle Dun

Chris, while you may not think abti-vaxxers are idiots, surely the people who make the propaganda are sinister and causing real harm in the world. Is this what Matt was really getting at, comparing the GMO example.

James P.

We need to add an "immoral grandstanding" dimension to the gurometer scale just for Scott Adams

Randy

Who do you think is more pathetic, Dave Rubin or Gad Saad? Rubin is obviously stupider, but who is more pathetic?

JGraves

Mr Rogers turned out to be the wonderful man I thought he was, btw

Mike

Lex Fraudman is simultaneously pretending to be a profound intellectual/philosopher and a naive, simple minded manchild. Which one is he really? I think he's neither, just a lying grifter.

Ryan Bruno

1:22:10 chris claims kendrick and lamar are beefing

Ben Godek

I will engage in some moral grandstanding and say that yes I think image generating AI is bad and that you should pay an artist for your thumbnails if you want them.

Ben Godek

I think JP Sears could be higher, I’m remembering his speeches about not wearing a mask so he could have real human connections in like the grocery store checkout line. Such an unnecessary elevation of banal social interactions to a highly morally charged pedestal.

YellowDreams

As someone who has ended up in protracted disagreements where I think Chris is wrong I feel for Matt's unwillingness to keep going back and forth forever.

Tom Allison

Fred Rogers as far morally superior to even the Dalai Lama is one of your most accurate and impressive conclusions, yet!

Neely McCormick

What is that piece of music you play at the end of the show? I find it oddly uplifting.

Tristram Vahan Draper

In the minor disagreement, Chris sounded like a cat stalking Matt. "Uh huh, uh huh, go ooooon"

Joseph Sullivan

Big congrats to the Cassandra of Canada, the one and only GOAT JBP - Alpha and Omega at last! what a ride it’s been old friend, we always knew you could do it. Can’t wait to see what the future has in store for the Terror from Toronto.

Matt Dear

"Elon Musk: Talking about saving humanity while doing the exact opposite. What a dick." LOL

DJ Wearing

I enjoyed that, and it got me curious about a lot of the earlier episodes of less prominent gurus I haven't listened to yet. One pedantic point I have is that I think Taleb should score higher on MG. You guys may not have known since Taleb blocked you both ;) but in Twitter he would often boast about his own highly moral behaviour ("skin in the game"). For example, he once described him and a friend going to a restaurant and when the bill came they had left the expensive wine off the bill by mistake. In the story Taleb tells the waiter/owner and they are moved to tears by his magnificence.

Ryan Bruno

Yall need to cover joe rogan’s favorable endorsement of kanyes heil hitler song. The struggle to say something negative was amazing

Duke

‘I know enough about the Dalai Lama to say he’s not above moral grand standing to serve his purposes’ - I know we only do secular gurus around here but I want to hear more about this!

Soapy Dishwater

i wish you guys paid less attention to the audience and reddit sometimes

Nat J

Man, if you give Mr. Rodger’s anything other than 0, your scale is completely broken. And surprised you’re not more familiar with him. One of the truly pure and beautiful products of US culture